[gigatexal]

So not teaching more people engineering is a good thing? Are you really advocating ignorance to artificially constrain the supply in the market of competent engineers? Non-competes, no-poaching, etc and illegal acts to constrain salaries are deplorable, yes, but are you going to be able to change the profit motive of business? Nope. What you can change is how you market yourself and seeking other opportunities for income be they freelancing or something similar. Think of a world that is much more educated now. There's untold industries and innovations that can be had and we markets for us to be employed in.

[quinequine]

Good point but you misunderstood my argument. It's in the interests of corporations to push up supply and if you look they are doing just that.

My concern is that without a counterbalance of developers advocating in the interest of the workforce; individuals will always be at a disadvantage.

Why? In a business everything comes second to profits and the accumulation of capital. Anyone who has worked at a startup outside of the US coasts knows this well.

I'm not saying we employ the old methods of unionization, but what am I saying is that we need collective bargaining.

It's up to us to identify a modern model that addresses your concerns.

[gigatexal]

I don't subscribe to all or nothings. Nobody is "always" a jerk. Nobody is "always" lazy. Neither are companies solely profit motivated. We don't live in a pure capitalist environment. This isn't a Ayn Rand novel. For example why would Google pay for free food for employees, why would other startups invest in so many "perks" to appease their employees.

I just think unions would dilute the market with highly paid developers on average but then average developers. Once you get the title of developer and get to be part of this union all developers regardless of skill would be paid the same. How is that fair? (If that's not how unions work then I cede my point).

[krapp]

Companies don't offer perks out of the kindness of their hearts, they do so as an investment out of which they expect a greater return.

The cost of things like "free food" is usually paid for with lower salaries, longer work hours or cuts to benefits. In other words, if the value of a perk is n, then the company offering that perk is extracting a greater than n value from their employees elsewhere, without compensation, or else passing the cost on to customers, or both.

TANSTAAFL.

[meddlepal]

There is a quota on doctors why not on engineers? We're already OK with the former.

[dpark]

I'm not okay with a quota on doctors. I'm certainly not okay with a quota on engineers, especially since that's a massive incentive to offshoring to somewhere that isn't stupid enough to artificially constrain the number of engineers.

[gigatexal]

Got a link to that quota on doctors?

[dpark]

There is no formal quota on doctors but the number of residencies limits the number of doctors that can actually get licensed. I've seen it argued that this is intentionally restricted to limit the number of doctors entering the field.