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by turc1656 3430 days ago
"However, the bad news is that hand-typed passwords are increasingly seen as the way of the past; hardware tokens and biometric sensing are considered to be far more usable, and will likely be employed more and more in the future."

Anytime you sacrifice security for convenience or simplicity, you lose. That's why I have no intention of ever using anything other than good ol' alphanumeric passwords that must be entered by hand. Anything that doesn't originate directly from my mind is not really protected at all. If all the government needs to do to grab all my data is take my hand and scan it, or hold my eyeball to a sensor, then it's all pointless.

2 comments

> Anytime you sacrifice security for convenience or simplicity, you lose.

No, you don't. And it's exactly this kind of black and white, all or nothing thinking that has hampered the success of the security community for decades.

Security folks, for obvious reasons, are only ever thinking about user scenarios where active security is needed. Scenes involving rubber hoses, angry cops, jealous spouses, competing corporations, etc. Those scenes matter, but they are a very small fraction of most users lives'.

Users are not stupid. When they reason about security, they think about all of the scenarios in their life. And, for every time they get picked up by the secret police and would be really glad they picked a 14-digit alphanumeric passcode, they know there are a million more times where they wanted to take a picture of that cute thing their kid is doing right now and don't want to spend the time unlocking the phone.

That is a real win in the user's mind. And those many small conveniences and joys are a huge part of the equation of their life.

Well-designed systems give users good security by integrating into their whole life, not just the idealized nefarious circumstances security folks spend all day thinking about. If you make your security too annoying, users will route around it, and now they have no security.

Why not both? A password with a U2F security key seems hard to beat.
I use this combo whenever possible, though the number of services yet supporting FIDO/U2F is still a bit disappointing. It's been incredibly convenient to be able to use my bitcoin hardware wallets to double as U2F keys wherever I need them. Given that any device I would use an OTP or text 2FA solution with already requires time to unlock, it's far less convenient on top of being more exploitable.
Are you using the ledger as a wallet? Doesn't plugging the device into an untrusted PC worry you at all? Leaving all that aside, the biggest issue for me an u2f is the mobile problem I have a yubikey neo, but u2f does not work over nfc, so I'm still stuck creating application passwords for things.
The Ledger is designed to plug into an untrusted PC, that's the whole point. It's running secure hardware and never reveals the private key. It also has a display that tells you how much you're sending and to what address, so you're protected even if you have spyware that attempts to spoof those parameters.

According to Yubikey, "All YubiKey NEO devices manufactured as of February 10, 2015 supported the current FIDO U2F specification for NFC."

https://www.yubico.com/products/yubikey-hardware/yubikey-neo...

Maybe you have an older device? Or, if you have an iPhone, it's Apple that's the problem, since it restricts NFC to Apple's own payment system. With Android, NFC is available to any app.

You're correct, but the implementation is limited. Chrome supports it, I think via Google Authenticator, but even their Gmail app doesn't support it directly. Nor does Dropbox, which are my primary two use cases. I highly doubt most other apps do either. The Google Authenticator support is a step, but it really needs to move to "enter password, tap token" in any app to really be useful.
Even better. My point was only that I will never use something that doesn't require an alphanumeric password. Anything added on top of that like two-factor just sweetens the pot.