[Corristowolf]

Obama was the one who implemented the visa ban for 7 islamic countries. Trump is just continuing the policy and added a LGBTQ clause. The left is blowing this out of proportion, just because it's Trump. They had no problem with airstrikes everyday that Obama was in office. I wish the press could be more objective. Every country has a right to deny access to people from other countries. Same with all the islamic middle eastern countries banning people from Israel. It's a political game, and every country has that right. For you to travel to another country, it's a privilege not a right.

"In order to protect Americans, the United States must ensure that those admitted to this country do not bear hostile attitudes toward it and its founding principles. The United States cannot, and should not, admit those who do not support the Constitution, or those who would place violent ideologies over American law. In addition, the United States should not admit those who engage in acts of bigotry or hatred (including "honor" killings, other forms of violence against women, or the persecution of those who practice religions different from their own) or those who would oppress Americans of any race, gender, or sexual orientation."

Source: https://web.archive.org/web/20170130005111/http://www.cnn.co...

[mikeash]

I have seen this statement several times now. Obama did the same thing, and nobody complained.

It's not the same thing at all. Obama didn't block people who already have valid visas. Obama didn't block green card holders.

Why do you say it's the same? Do you consider those two things to be essentially the same, or are you ignorant of the actual substance of one or both of these actions, or what?

[mst]

Green card holders are being exempted, that was shitshow disorganisation rather than policy.

This policy is still not the same though, no.

The previous administration only suspended Iraqi refugee processing for ~6 months.

The thing I'm mostly annoyed about is people claiming "only the new administration would pick this list of countries" when they inherited the list. I'd much rather we focused on how much worse things they're doing with the list instead.

[mikeash]

It was policy. Then that policy was loosened. The loosening is rather vague and still leaves a lot of room for trouble, so it remains to be seen just what the practical effects are. Now they "will be allowed to board U.S. bound aircraft and will be assessed for exceptions at arrival ports of entry."

I totally agree that focusing on the list itself is silly. It's a good example of why Trump should have divested his business interests prior to taking office, to avoid this kind of questioning of his motives. But it certainly doesn't look like these countries were chosen in any way based on his business holdings.

[Corristowolf]

And this policy is also for 90days.

[jartelt]

And then they can issue another executive order that says the same thing for another 120 days... This looks like a textbook example of issuing a controversial and overreaching order, waiting for the push-back, saying "we will fix the issues on a case-by-case basis, trust us", and then waiting for the push-back to drop in intensity. In the end, we are still left with a controversial and overreaching order and the president can decide to not fix the issue as promised.

[csears]

Obama barred access to the Visa Waiver Program for "High Risk" countries. This was not an outright ban on immigration, it just eliminated access to a "fast lane" for people who needed to visit the US for 90 days or less.

Source: https://www.congress.gov/bill/114th-congress/house-bill/158/...

[ChefDenominator]

Obama also bombed them.

[AJ007]

The US has had continuous bombing/droning of Muslim countries for 15 years now.

Most recently, UN estimates of civilians killed in Yemen, many by US-made bombs ( https://www.hrw.org/news/2016/12/08/yemen-us-made-bombs-used... ) exceeds 4,000 ( https://www.hrw.org/news/2017/01/12/yemen-no-accountability-... ), I've seen others around 10,000+. That was an Obama-backed campaign.

I have a lot of respect for the people who have been protesting the entire time. I have a great deal of suspicion of those who are suddenly speaking up.

Does SV care about human rights, or are they more concerned about their continued access to H1-B Visa holders?

[chimeracoder]

> They had no problem with airstrikes everyday that Obama was in office.

Speaking as a person who had a very, very big problem with Obama bombing civilians in countries we're not even at war with, I'll point out that what Trump is already doing with respect to immigration does go far beyond what Obama did.

Under Obama, there was never any doubt that a green card holder would be permitted reentry as long as they followed the same restrictions that have been in place for decades (e.g. don't get convicted of a felony, don't stay away for more than six months at a time). That is no longer true.

The same applies to someone who holds dual citizenship with the U.K. and Iran. Under the new policy (which is admittedly in flux and is being actively tested in court), a British Iranian cannot enter. That was never an issue before.

[jbi]

Could you bring up a source for your first statement?

Obama stopped the refugee programm for Iraqi citizens for 6 months - it never affected people with valid green cards or dual passports.

[joshuahedlund]

It's true that many on "the left" / "the media" were going to freak out even if Trump did exactly the same thing as Obama. But this fact is distracting many honest and sincere conservatives from the more disturbing fact that Trump did not do the same thing as Obama, but in fact did way more in a very reckless manner. (Besides, if it was the same thing Obama did, it wouldn't have required an executive order.)

Stopping new applications from one country for six months is not the same thing as cutting off refugees from all countries who had already passed the process, out of the blue with no warning, stopping people at airports until judges stepped in. halting this process from one country is not the same as cutting off all immigrants from seven countries with no warning, including legal permanent residents who happened to be visiting home. The green card policy was only reversed after already disrupting lots of lives, and the details are all still very unclear and confusing.

Partisanship blinds both sides to the real issues. Many liberals freak out about everything Trump does. Many conservatives, who previously criticized Obama's executive orders, react to this by showing more concern about leftist hysteria regarding abuse of power than the actual extremely concerning abuse of power itself.

[Corristowolf]

There is an exemption for people who are already in the states. That was just shitty organization.

[metalon]

They are not simply banning new foreigners from entering the country (which alone would be bad enough, imho), but also many green card holders who were legal residents and now face an uncertain future. Also, does "In addition, the United States should not admit those [...] who would oppress Americans of any race, gender, or sexual orientation" apply to everyone? That would mean bad news for Mike Pence, among others

[e40]

Obama was the one who implemented the visa ban for 7 islamic countries. Trump is just continuing the policy and added a LGBTQ clause.

The trolls have entered the conversation.

[ChefDenominator]

Exactly. The left is going to end up being extinct, and it has no clue why.

Obama oversees war for every day of his two terms, and we hear nothing, because, I guess, bombing people isn't hateful.

Trump takes office, continues the policies of Obama, and he's hateful. It's the left that is prejudice in assuming that those in the middle and the right can't see through this.

I see zero effort to change strategy or tactic, so we can all look forward to a second term of Trump.