[_andromeda_]

It may not be so as it is but left to the devices of Trump's detractors, the ultimate goal is to be as limitless as you can.

Even if that isn't the case, can you honestly say we live in times where we can ignore that more needs to be done? To me, it is absolutely binary; either you think more should be done or you don't.

The real debate here is whether Trump's ban constitutes doing what's necessary and I say yes.

[grzm]

If you expect others to engage you in nuanced discussion, you need to do so yourself, which not only means being more careful with language like "indiscriminate", but also includes avoiding sweeping generalizations like "left to the devices of Trump's detractors, the ultimate goal is to be as limitless as you can."

All around are accusations of "they're not listening to us", "they don't really understand the problem", "they don't realize the logical conclusion of their positions". A lot of people are barely talking at each other, much less actually with each other.

I can — and do — honestly say we live in times where we need to spend a lot more effort in listening and understanding each other, as people, as opposed to partisans.