Hacker News new | ask | show | jobs
by alkonaut 3448 days ago
What is an example use for this chip on its own? Can it be made to run on low enough power to run on a battery?
2 comments

Most people use these little things for sensor/data loggers (weather stations, power monitoring, indoor temperature, etc) or little widgets that need connectivity and can be tethered to a power outlet (small display showing the weather outside, etc)

The specs say it has 0.9 mA light sleep, and a 10 uA deep sleep. Assuming the specs are correct (I haven't test it yet... not sure anyone else has either) you could definitely run it off a battery if you aren't waking it up too often.

The real problem with the RTL8710 (and ESP8266, and any other chip that uses WiFi) is that WiFi is very energy intensive. It takes a lot of juice to blast out a 2.4Ghz signal.

I don't know what the numbers are for the RTL8710, but the ESP8266 uses 50-170mA when receiving/transmitting data, which will drain a battery very quickly. (Source: http://bbs.espressif.com/viewtopic.php?t=133)

Pretty much all WiFi transceivers are indeed power-intensive, but it is actually receiving that often takes more juice.

ESP8266 consumes ~70mA with both CPU and WiFi running but idle, and 15mA with CPU idling and WiFi powered down [1]. That's 55mA or (@3.3v) ~180mW for _idle_ (i.e. receiving) WiFi circuitry. Again - that's WiFi only, with exactly zero RF power transmitted.

Now transmit. EU restricts amount of RF power radiated by a WiFi station/AP to 100mW. In US and few other places you can go slightly higher, but then other challenges arise, so for practical purpose most WiFi chipsets top out at 100 mW (a.k.a. 20dBm). Assuming RF power amplifier has efficiency of 32% [2], transmit duty cycle of 50% (that's transmitting half of the time and receiving for another half - pretty intense traffic here), we get:

(100/32%)*50% = just 156mW consumed towards "blasting out" some RF.

Clearly, receiving WiFi takes more. And there is a good reason for that. Most modern designs implement Rx as: Low-noise amplifier with some bandpass filtering -> Zero-IF mixer -> quadrature ADC -> DSP. It's the latter that does FFT, I/Q constellation tracking, demodulation, forward error correction, etc. essentially in software. And that takes a lot of power.

[1] http://bbs.espressif.com/viewtopic.php?t=133

[2] http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/DeviceDoc/75003C.pdf

Ah, neat. Thanks for the analysis! I always assumed it was the transmit that ate the power, simply because you need `x` amount of energy to broadcast the signal out. But I can absolutely see how it's the circuitry associated with getting a signal back into digital that could be costly instead

TIL :)

thank you. I suppose the critical factor is, how long and how often does it have to wake up, and more importantly, how many milliseconds of wifi power is needed to transmit whatever data was gathered.
http://aitendo3.sakura.ne.jp/aitendo_data/product_img/wirele... says 180mAh when actively transmitting, so probably.