[gumby]

> The Chinese have a "face saving is the most important thing" culture, and the US does not. Think of it more like the tribal regions of the -stans: China is metaphorically ready to do some honor killing over this in a way we can't grok.

Please, can we ditch the outdated stereotypes? The Chinese govt uses the parallel tropes to the US ("we've suffered under years of foreign domination" "Here we're on an anti-corruption campaign so you don't have to suffer under unnecessary taxes" etc. And funding local SoEs to keep the jobs flowing).

Is make America Great Again any different? "Other countries are laughing at us." "We never win any more""We're going to bring back coal"

I just picked MAGA because it was a recent successful platform. But consider dispassionately: 15 years ago a small bunch of bandits killed 3000 people and cause a few billion in property damage. IN return the US has spent trillions killing people who had nothing to do with it in order to to restore its honor. Movies from Rambo to Shooter to anything by Chuck Norris are simply ways to pander to loss of face.

Of course there are differences between the two but let's stick to facts.

[lacampbell]

It's not an outdated stereotype. There are fundamental differences between eastern and western cultures. Individualistic vs collectivist, guilt based vs shame based.

The very fact that English has the expression "Lose Face" is because it was translated from Chinese and imported into the language in the 19th century[0].

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Face_(sociological_concept)#En...

[fjdlwlv]

You should look up what the movie Rambo is actually about. It's an interesting and important story.

[gumby]

That's really my point in those examples: Rambo and Shooter have an explicit story that ties to a particular individualistic-in-group-context narrative, but they also rest upon an underlying group identification and sense of group shame. Shooter is interesting in that I don't feel race plays any role in the group, except through the use of an "outside mercenary"