[gravypod]

I've had professors do this to me. I don't understand what's wrong with this. This is a common thing I even do when grading programming assignments. When I notice a stylistic choice that is outside of the norm for the students I can usually tell exactly who the work came from. Every semester I catch at least one group of cheaters (This semester I caught two!) and they admit to it after I confront them with it.

"Hence" is fairly common in modern English, but is it common in the writings of this student?

One such example of this is that one of my students used a "while not in" loop which they had never done before. I looked at it puzzled for a second and then went "wait a minute, one of my other students used this in every lab since we introduced the while statement". I pull up the code, compare it, and BAM! I've got a match.

Just because something is possible/correct in a language and that the person wiring the piece has every bit of ability to use the complex structure at had it doesn't mean they would normally do so. Sure it's not accurate, and sure you may not be right with every call (hasn't happened to me yet but other TAs have called people out and have turned out to be wrong), but it's something that I'd call a "clue" that something is different.

Either the student put more time into the work and found a better/alternate way of approaching the problem, the student asked a friend to help with describing the structure (or in this case what wording to use), or in the only case that presents malice: they copied it.

The only way you can find out is by going to the student and confidently saying something to the effect of "I know you've engaged in some questionalbe academic behavior, this is your time to explain yourself before I contact my boss and have them run a more though investigation". Cheaters usually crack instantly. (pro-tip for anyone on the outside who is cheating: just lie to us, we're probably not going to follow up unless it's extremely obvious if you've got a 1/4 way decent explanation).

I see nothing wrong with this. Just talk to the professors boss and they'll sort it out. This is especially true for cases where you actually did write the work.

Also, I highly doubt anyone questions the intellect of the writer. They are obviously a gifted person.

[analog31]

The only way you can find out is by going to the student and confidently saying something to the effect of "I know you've engaged in some questionalbe academic behavior, this is your time to explain yourself before I contact my boss and have them run a more though investigation". Cheaters usually crack instantly. (pro-tip for anyone on the outside who is cheating: just lie to us, we're probably not going to follow up unless it's extremely obvious if you've got a 1/4 way decent explanation).

For some reason, I immediately thought of that popular video: "Don't talk to the police." Today, I'd probably assume that if you're fishing for a confession, then you don't have any evidence, and your "boss" doesn't exist. For instance, when I was an adjunct, I didn't have support like that from my department.

What I don't know is how I'd have reacted as a college student with less confidence and street smarts, and with a possibly justifiable fear of antagonizing a teacher.

[gravypod]

> For some reason, I immediately thought of that popular video: "Don't talk to the police." Today, I'd probably assume that if you're fishing for a confession, then you don't have any evidence, and your "boss" doesn't exist.

Absolutely. Never talk to me either. Never talk to the professor. Tell them "an investigation is better as it will prove your innocence and resolve the issue more quickly then my explanations will" and walk away if you did cheat. If the prisoners dilemma all over again especially since it takes 2 to cheat in most cases.

> For instance, when I was an adjunct, I didn't have support like that from my department.

I'm different in that I'm not a professor, I help teach and grade a class so I work underneath a professor who allows me to lecture some times and help guide the class but it's not "my" class. As a grader I see all the students work and as an attentive grader I memorize the students names and styles. When I catch a cheater I email my boss and the professor I work under and they advise me on what to do (which is usually to allow me to write my strongly worded letter of doom that anyone who's done something iffy on the internet has received once or twice). The policy in this programming class is that it's not cheating if you credit each other with parts of the work you've done but the less astute observers won't remember that and will try and hide their work.

> What I don't know is how I'd have reacted as a college student with less confidence and street smarts, and with a possibly justifiable fear of antagonizing a teacher.

Some of these kids are in other classes I'm taking and they are still afraid when I bring it up. It's the fear that I will involve the administration that works here. The carrot or the stick. They assume I'm the carrot and I'm going to just mark them zero if they fess up. They assume that the school is the stick and they will get the full penalty.

If it were up to me any cheating would be handled officially through the university but that isn't our SOP. We find cheaters usually fail. As such we just tell them "we know and we are going to give you a 0 for this and next exam". That usually deters cheating as they need to retake the class then.

[analog31]

That's interesting. I suspect a grader with your level of interest and diligence is a rare bird.

While in college, my writing style changed from week to week, as I was influenced by professors, my readings, and so forth. That was in my humanities courses. I didn't take any programming courses while in college.

I'm kind of glad that I finished college before the Internet age. I never cheated, but am glad that I didn't have to work in such an adversarial atmosphere.

I'm sure it's not your intention, but "stop and accuse" sounds a lot like "stop and frisk." It sounds like a recipe for abuse.

[random567]

part of the problem is public shaming

    > This morning, my professor handed me back a paper (a literature review) in front of my entire class and exclaimed “this is not your language.”

While it's reasonable to ask someone if they've plagiarized, asking that person about it in public in front of their classmates is mean-spirited.

[rocqua]

There is also something about the extreme emphasis on 'this is not your word'. Much like the public shaming, it suggests the professor is not just displeased, but viscerally outraged.

[gravypod]

You may not know this but it is an offensive thing to see a student fail or cheat to get out of failure. It's not right to get mad about it but that doesn't change the fact that it does happen.

I try not to get mad and I try to be as objective as possible but after I know for sure it is very disappointing. It's a reflection of my abilities I feel.

[gravypod]

I usually confront the student by asking them to speak to me after class in front of the entire class. It's not shaming as in reality no one cares, everyone knows no one cares, and most students in shitty classes do it. There is one class at my university that students cannot pass without old exams. The teacher doesn't rotate questions and doesn't talk about anything on the exams so it's useless to pay attention. It's basically a study/homework session at school that's a given C to B because you know all the questions on the exam.

Everyone cheats in some way. What I am concerned about is disingenuous cheating where a student obviously is preforming poorly in non-adverse conditions and decides to take it upon themselves to rectify the situation in a non-productive manor.

[dilemma]

> Just because something is possible/correct in a language and that the person wiring the piece has every bit of ability to use the complex structure at had it doesn't mean they would normally do so. Sure it's not accurate, and sure you may not be right with every call (hasn't happened to me yet but other TAs have called people out and have turned out to be wrong), but it's something that I'd call a "clue" that something is different.

So the next time your write an HN comment and don't misspell "hand" we will know that you've plagiarized.

[gravypod]

I've got pretty bad dislexia as noted by my professors, colleges, and highschool teachers. It's extremely hard for me to write something without spelling errors. So in fact yes it's entirely plausible to use that to identify my speech.

[dilemma]

So if you make an effort to correct mistakes due to your dyslexia it actually means you plagiarized your work?

[gravypod]

I've never been able to correctly spell every word in an essay I've ever handed in. It's not impossible to correct this but when I correct this the rest of my writing style will not change. One of the assignments in the CS track at my college is text analysis. From extremely basic identifies you can tell approximately who wrote some text. Even just by counting "a" and "an" you can discern the author.

Unfortunately some people don't seem to understand that there is a correlation between vocabulary, work flow, word choice, and the writer.

[killaken2000]

or "writing" instead of wiring

[kaitai]

You can find out with a less accusatory attitude, as well, if there has never been questionable behavior before. "Tell me about your process. Can you show me any notes or drafts? Discuss this paragraph with me. Without looking at the paper, can you explain what you're trying to say with this argument?"

Whether they wrote it themselves comes out pretty quickly, even if they won't admit to cheating. If a student can't explain his or her work, then you have a basis for giving a lower grade or pressing on the cheating accusation.

[gravypod]

We tried that recently with one of our students. You can definitely tell who is a cheater right off the bat based on their attitude in class. The kind of student who is driven to understand the world around them is not the kind of student who needs to cheat to obtain this knowledge.

After the recent midterm we gave out for one of my students I received two copes of the exam, one had a 20pts higher grade. Due to errors made on our side of the line it seemed as if the student had taken the exam, left a room, and taken it again at another room to score higher. We thought as soon as we saw him that he was a nice kid and so we should go lighter on him. All it did was freak the kid out. He couldn't make full sentences without stuttering because he thought we knew he was cheating.

I think this falls on a fault of our own. We didn't ask the right questions--the professor and I. We asked "did you take two copies of the exam" and he said yes, we then asked "did you change rooms" and he didn't respond, he just looked confused. We took him to my boss and my boss just gave him the exams and said "can you explain this". After that the kid went and explained exactly what happened.

I don't know if it's coming across correctly but basically we lead him into telling us he cheated. We "knew" that he cheated when it was really an error on our side. My boss was level headed and just said that we would start an investigation into cheating if he cannot explain himself and tell us what happened that day. When given the change rather then asked leading questions he was better able to articulate himself. It's my opinion now that asking any questions is a horrible idea for confronting a cheater. You just need to tell them what information you have and how this is going to be bad for them and they can fill in the blanks otherwise you will have accidentally lead them into a trap where they say they did something that they obviously didn't do as in the case of this student.

[CalChris]

What you did makes sense. This is the standard two tier laboratory testing process. The first screening test is cheap with some false positives. The second confirmation test is more troublesome but more accurate.

The professor did the first and evidently only the first.

[gravypod]

Handing back a scored paper would probably be one of the ways I'd test for a written plagiarism. If the student gets mad at me and fights then they didn't plagiarizer. It's the presumed nature of humans to want to fight back when wrongly accused of something--even more so when you're found guilty of something. I'd accept a rebuttal saying that's not a correct model for every student and as such I'd find it evenly as "not-suspicious" if the person went to my boss or the dean and asked for them to get the points back.

If the student does nothing then I'd assume they did copy.

I'm sure people will be mad about these assumptions but from my experience--and from what I've seen my colleges fall into after wrongly accusing someone of cheating--I'd definitely say this is an appropriate average model. I'd also say it's lived to fruition in this case. The author got mad and wrote a fantastic expose on this situation. If I was the professor I'd correct what was obviously my mistake at this point.

[analog31]

In my view, the problem with using psychological manipulation tactics, is that it abuses the asymmetrical relationship between the teacher and the student. I think it would be more ethical for the teacher to simply lay their cards on the table. If they have evidence, present it directly, otherwise wait for another day.

[snovv_crash]

The problem here is that you are effectively punishing students who have done nothing wrong. This is a great way to get an uncooperative class who don't really care about the work beyond the grade they get at the end.

[gravypod]

Again, I've never caught a student who didn't admit to it. Those who have apologize and restore credit.

The student is usually happier to have that it seems since they get to say "I fought the law and the law didn't win" to their friends and classmates. The teacher does look like an idiot to the class after that though.

It may well come a time when I make the same mistake but at that point I'll be excited to admit I was wrong and restore credit. I'm not ashamed at failing myself, only know-it-all-do-nothings are afraid of ruining their street cred.