[masklinn]

> A maxxed out MBP costs €5000

That's quite dishonest considering a fair bit of that is the 1700€ 2TB SSD (which is not an unfair price, that's about what Samsung announced for the 960 Pro)

> which is $5447.95.

Also dishonest, most people expect USD prices to be without tax, you're including the ~20% european VATs in that by converting back from tax-included euro prices.

[dogma1138]

The 960 pro 2TB costs between 1200 and 1300 EUR (depending on the country and store, or ~1100 GBP in the UK) that's 400-500 EUR difference and it's unlikely that you'll get an NVME drive faster than the 960 Pro, in fact it would not surprise me if it's the 960 pro in it, and if it's not in all honesty it's likely to be inferior.

1700 EUR for an upgrade is ridiculous even if the 960 Pro would cost 1700 EUR which it doesn't even remotely do the upgrade should've been it's price minus the price of the 512GB SSD. Effectively Apple is charging you anywhere between 2100 and 2500 EUR (2100 if you use the 960 pro 512 price, 2500 if you use the "apple price") for that 2TB SSD.

This is by no shape or form acceptable, taxes or anything else be damned.

[0x0]

Fine, maxxed out except 1TB instead of 2TB SSD and the total is €4.039. The bump up/down from 2TB to 1TB is "only" €960.

Also sales tax isn't dishonest. I have to pay it to buy the machine!!

This is a ton more money than what maxxed out macbook pros were around 2013 in €, and to be honest the total package feels like a downgrade.

[masklinn]

> Also sales tax isn't dishonest.

I didn't say sales tax was dishonest, I said converting back a tax included price into USD was, and explained why. Aside from US sales tax being much lower than european ones (as low as 0%) US prices are pretty much always displayed without taxes, so you're making the machine look 20% more expensive than it actually is as far as american viewers understand it. A fair quote would have been to provide the regular USD price ($4300 maxxed out, or $3500 for 1TB).

[0x0]

Well if US sales taxes are as low as 0% then I think it IS a fair comparison.

Feature-wise, it feels like the 2013 device is worth the 2016 price and the 2016 device is worth the 2013 price.

[masklinn]

> Well if US sales taxes are as low as 0% then I think it IS a fair comparison.

That's completely nonsensical, Apple doesn't decide where you live and they don't set how much VAT to apply, they've got a "manufacturer price" and add VAT on top.

[cynix]

> That's completely nonsensical, Apple doesn't decide where you live and they don't set how much VAT to apply

The point is that it is possible to buy it somewhere in the US without tax, whereas no such method exists in the EU.

[masklinn]

Saying that you don't want to pay VAT is not a point.

[0x0]

My original point was that the € price for a maxed out machine appears much higher than previous MacBook Pro launches, regardless of sales tax. The USD conversion was just a side note.

[Zikes]

> Also sales tax isn't dishonest. I have to pay it to buy the machine!!

What they mean to say is that VAT is included in the price tag in Europe, so when people see the € number they'll say "and that's exactly what it will cost" whereas in the US prices are before tax, so we will mentally inflate the number by ~10% when we see it.

[monatron]

It is if you're making a critique of the manufacturer. Apple has no control over where you choose to buy the machine.

[SysArchitect]

US sales taxes vary depending on state. There is no direct comparison.