[nickbail3y]

I'm not sure where this narrative is coming from. TOR was developed as an anonymous network by the US Naval Research Lab. It was designed for use by military and intelligence. TOR was never just some academic experiment.

TOR is still a valid tool. No, it wasn't designed to foil NSA level surveillance, because it was built by the US. But this vulnerability isn't even related to TOR, it has to do with the TOR Browser.

The Snowden leaks contain slides where the NSA clearly laments the use of TOR, so saying that it never has been trustworthy is simply not true.

[Mizza]

It was "designed" for military use in the sense they were computer scientists working for the Naval research, but the community felt like an academic one. For instance, it was originally published at USENIX. The majority of discussion of Tor was related to papers on Anonbib, not about code itself. TBB didn't even exist until much later. I've never seen any evidence that it was ever used "in production" by the military before it was made public.

Re: The NSA Tor slides - they're really not as damning as you say - http://i.imgur.com/cnOeVQf.png - and they're also made before the FBI was caught using remote code execution exploits against Tor users.

[nickbail3y]

> but the community felt like an academic one

How do you know what the development environment 'felt' like? Are you Roger Dingledine or Nick Mathewson?

And I doubt that you will find any evidence that it was used before being made public. Using TOR before it was public would be like screaming, "HEY I'M HIDING SOMETHING! AND I'M US MILITARY OR INTELLIGENCE!". The whole point of releasing it was to gather a userbase. Otherwise, TOR wouldn't be very anonymous at all.

[Mizza]

I was working on a related anonymity project at the same time, funded by the same grant giving organization. I lurked and participated, I have met RD and NM IRL, and I have been a hidden service operator for many years. That being said, I am only at the far periphery of the project. But, I have been out here for a while and I stand by my original statement.

[nickbail3y]

Well despite our differences in opinion, I respect your contribution to anonymity and privacy. And I'm a bit envious that you've met RD and NM.

[petertodd]

They're just normal guys, who are quite approachable - go to the right conferences and you'll meet them.

[lallysingh]

Almost all the research out of NRL feels academic. It's fundamental research by professional scientists. I don't know what else you'd expect.

[Mizza]

Of course, this is exactly my point. I think Tor was healthier when it was academic, not activist.