[tptacek]

ITT was anything but a ladder of economic mobility. It preyed on those people who most needed that mobility. The institutions you're squeamish about harming are community colleges, which have much cheaper tuitions and actually do educate students.

[pauldix]

Yep, community colleges are where it's at. I started at a small local college a half-step up from a community college as it offered 4 year degrees. Got a year's worth of credits there to establish a good record and then transferred out to an ivy.

My brother got his 4 year degree from the same college, moved onto a master's at a bigger school and is doing quite well.

[tptacek]

The problem with for-profit schools like ITT and Phoenix is clearer when you see those companies as a sustained effort to profit by delegitimizing community college.

[dionidium]

By positioning themselves as the no-nonsense-career-training, direct-path-to-a-job alternative? Is that what you mean?

[dccoolgai]

I think that is maybe where my uncomfortable feeling comes from: community college seems like an "extension" of the grand idea of higher education (which is awesome for people that want that!)- become a more well-rounded person, read the classics, learn history and art appreciation, etc. etc. - it's what I did, and I enjoyed it... but I know I'm not everyone. I grew up in a very poor place where it might just serve people better to "learn the things you need to know to pass for XYZ 9-5 job" and from what I read ITT (sort of) fit the bill. I worry that we're saying "You can't do that - you have to go try and be a well-rounded renaissance man/woman"... now I know that with federal money, maybe we have the right to say it, but still...

[dragonwriter]

Community colleges (at least the one's I've seen) tend to have both traditional academic programs intended to fill the lower division of a classical four-year college program and vocational programs leading to a two-year degree or vocational certificate (or where you might just take a few ad hoc classes for career advancement without enrolling in any kind of certificate/degree program.)

The idea that the ITTs of the world are more effective for vocational education than Community Colleges is a product of the massive marketing campaigns of ITT-style for-profit institutions more than any reality, as far as I can tell,

[kayla210]

I went the community-college-then-university route as well. I got enough credits to get an associate's degree before transferring and was able to put that on my resume, which I feel got me some attention when I was applying for part-time programming jobs as I finished my bachelor's.