[jdmichal]

> I find it nice that the complexity of the universe hides it from us and it only occasionally comes up in discussions like this.

I agree. I find arguments for lack of free will strange. If we don't have it, then what's the point of anything, including arguing whether we have it? It's not about being right or wrong for me, but rather that I'll always accept the illusion of free will, because anything else is just boring and depressing.

And who knows, maybe in the end we'll discover that there's randomized quantum effects that break the determinism. While not quite free will, at least it's an out from the boring and depressing alternative.

[allendoerfer]

We are tiny unimportant ants on a tiny and unimportant planet floating meaningless through time and space and yet we are alive and are at the same time already distanced so far from the act of surviving. I think there is no point in anything, but consciousness and thoughts are a pretty awesome compensation to me.

I personally believe that quantum effects don't break the determinism, just because I like to. Otherwise there is more space for a god and I am to lazy to invent my own, while I am absolutely certain that the current ideas of him are wrong. I like the idea that there has been something at the beginning much more. Then it can be something simple like "time does not flow linearly" and you are done.

In the end it does not matter whether we will take even more blue pills or somehow get to experience the red pill. Either way it is a hell of a show and not boring at all.