[cocktailpeanuts]

> For over 5 Apple laptops of various kinds, I've never seen that, with heavy programming/VM use, or DAW and NLE use. A little warmer yes. Ouch, my hands hurt? No. Does that really happen, and can we have some actual temperature measurements, or is it just that some people are too sensitive?

Yes it does happen. I have had two macbook pros, two macbook airs. It happened to every single one of them when it was time for their death. Maybe you've been switching your macbooks before something like that happened. It's not like I get a serious burn but it sure is very irritating and even hurts if I keep it there for too long.

> Those are probably the worst examples to cite, as the original iPhone and iPad were mighty fine. It's mostly with 1st generations of Mac redesigns that things sometimes get bad for some production runs (faults found in new materials/suppliers/designs etc).

I bought the first iPad, and it was super heavy. They came out with a lighter iPad soon after. In my opinion the best timing to buy any Apple product is their second iteration. The second version is always significantly better than the first one and then the perceived variance is not as severe afterwards.

> Compared to which company that is? Because I mostly see either PR projects (like Google glass) or failed semi-copies (Surface capped to 1M unit sales etc).

I'm comparing it to Apple itself. Comparing to other companies has no meaning. Just because other companies are not being innovative doesn't make Apple an innovative company, has nothing to do with each other.

[coldtea]

>I bought the first iPad, and it was super heavy. They came out with a lighter iPad soon after.

Well, I had the first iPad, and have been using it for a god 4-5 years until I got an iPad 4. It being heavy is just what the technology afforded at the time, not some unique case of making the customer a guinea pig.

>* I'm comparing it to Apple itself. Comparing to other companies has no meaning. Just because other companies are not being innovative doesn't make Apple an innovative company, has nothing to do with each other.*

Innovative (which I dislike as a word in general for this use, as people conflate it with anything, from primary physics research to new case designs) is relative.

Some company is innovative because others make less new things. If HP for example produced marvels of novel technology year after year since 1999, then we wouldn't call Apple or anyone else innovative with the "mere updates" they've put out (in comparison).