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by mucker 3622 days ago
What on Earth are you talking about. Let's presume you are right and Turkey wasn't being kept out for things like, oh as another pointed out, an occupation of Turkey and Cyprus, how does blocking them from joining the EU make them less moderate? Does the EU have magic dust that effects religious outcomes?
2 comments
gonvaled 3622 days ago
I dont know. They were moderate, we said they dont belong to EU because they are muslim (lots of people said that), and they became fundamentalist.

It is true that fundamentalism is on the rise worldwide (also in christian countries) but my impression is that, in Turkeys case, it was the EU attitude which caused lots of turkish people to vote for a strong islamic president.

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pas 3622 days ago
> it was the EU attitude which caused lots of turkish people to vote for a strong islamic president.

Or it was just a temporary aligning of views that Erdogan and AKP initially seemed to be moderates, but it turned out that the sheep is actually a wolf with a sheepskin. It happened in history already a few times.

Also, diluting the progressive thought of the EU would likely have prevented it from being an effective counterforce to radicalization. (Though it could have moderated things a bit in Turkey.)

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pjlegato 3622 days ago
Indeed, Hungary shows the EU's magic dust has little to no ability to induce moderation.
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gonvaled 3622 days ago
That's one example. There are other 27 (soon 26).

Dont get we wrong: I dont think it's magic, just than then, and for Turkey, it would have worked.

And more important: it would have been the right signal to send, to the whole world

I sincerily think that was our best chance, ever, to kill fundamentalism for good.

We will never know.

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pas 3622 days ago
Well, we don't know what would have happened if Hungary wasn't a Member State.
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pjlegato 3622 days ago
It doesn't matter, since the topic was whether being a member state ensures moderation.
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gonvaled 3622 days ago
It doesn't, but it can help. Anyway, in case of Hungary, they have already been warned by the EU a couple of times. Time will tell how this evolves, but weakening the project as UK has done will for sure reduce the incentives to return to a more moderate path.

These free-market types, they are really wreaking the world. The 1% capitalism we have reached is putting a death sign in the fundamentalist market ideology, but they are for sure going down with a bang.

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