[HalfwayToDice]

Immigration system for skilled workers is not going to change. If the UK actually does leave the EU, they'll replace EU rules of skilled immigration with something similar.

The UK is a knowledge economy, it will always be open to skilled immigrants. Yet people actually believe that the UK will close down all immigration. It's absurd.

[germanier]

I could hop on the next plane to London and legally start working today. If they restrict freedom of movement at all that is going to fall and replaced by some process to obtain work authorization (how else could they distinguish between "skilled" and "unskilled" workers?). If that system looks in any way similiar to the one non-EU citizens have to go through today I wouldn't call that change insignificant. Having to do a financial striptease and waiting some time for the application to be processed (possibly even having to renew that a few times) instead of showing your ID card to HR is going to stop some people from working there.

And I don't want to start talking about other things, such as access to social security and cross-border cooperation thereof, automatic recognition of degrees and certifications, harmonized banking makes it easy to transfer to your home country, being able to quit a job without needing to have a new one lined-up, and so on. All that is now part of the negotiations.

[Symbiote]

> I could hop on the next plane to London and legally start working today.

That's exactly the point, and something I don't think many British people realise. (I don't think Americans etc realise it either, but I don't expect them to.)

Moving to work in a different EU country requires what I'd guess is a similar amount of paperwork as moving between US states.

- Register your address with the local government (which may lead to an id card, tax registration etc) - Update your driving license, if applicable - Tell the old country you'll stop paying tax there (may lead to a tax refund)

These are the same kinds of processes as are used when a child is born, a teenager gets a first job, or an adult moves house. Nothing requires permission, nothing can be refused.

Additionally, there are agreements for things like state healthcare, pensions and out-of-work benefits.

If the UK raises barriers, then London will be less appealing for other European citizens.

[Xylakant]

> nothing can be refused

This is a very crucial point that a lot of people fail to grasp. With the EU laws as backing, we moved from "this is easily granted unless you fill in the wrong paper" to "this can't be denied and you don't even have to ask." which is a complete turnaround in the power balance. Employing a person from the EU requires that I notify the relevant authorities, moving within the EU requires me to merely notify the right parties. There's no applying for a permit. Having a polish partner is much less stressful, because she can't be thrown out, no matter what, no need for a residence permit, no travel documents.

[fauigerzigerk]

We are a fintech startup in London. Some of us have advanced degrees. Others are skilled but have no degree to show for it.

There's a tsunami of red tape heading our way both in terms of visa regulations and in many other areas where EU and UK regulations are going to start to diverge.

Unless they quickly agree on Brexit in name only we will probably move into the EU, possibly to Scotland if they become independent.

[rsynnott]

> If the UK actually does leave the EU, they'll replace EU rules of skilled immigration with something similar.

Do you understand how EU freedom of movement works? As an EU citizen I can get on a plane tomorrow, and go to any other EU country, and work there. Skills or no skills. And if I'm not happy with my job there I can quit and get another without fear of being deported. And so on...

A points-based system would be a very different proposition. There'd be far more bureaucracy involved in getting in in the first place, and then once you're in there'd potentially be issues with changing job, and with long-term residence, and with medical care, and with this, that and the other.

There is no possible way in which shutting down free movement wouldn't make the UK a less attractive destination. Of course, this is irrelevant; the UK will almost certainly have to accept free movement as part of its future EEA or EFTA member status.

[blibble]

it's actually 'freedom of movement for workers': if you lose your job and can't get another, and don't have the ability to support yourself independently then the host country is within its rights to deport you

[germanier]

This right does not immediately cease to exist. If you lose your job you very likely have access to unemployment benefits for some time and there are certain conditions that need to be met before you can be deported. If you have lived there for at least five years it's basically impossible.

This is far stronger than anything you can get via other immigration routes and such deportations of EU citizens are really rare.

[pekk]

This is the attitude which caught the remain campaign flat-footed - the sense that what we traditionally believed about the UK can't change. We want to snuggle up in our blankets and think nothing can go wrong. But this referendum had legal force and won by a large margin, which is how things do change.

Legal aspects aside, this referendum was also a shot across the bow to foreigners. To have such a large majority expressing such a strong disdain should give pause to anyone considering immigration, because it is unpleasant and even dangerous to have neighbors who think of you like this. Seeing as Trump has made his campaign a referendum on immigration, it will be the same in the US if Trump is elected with a similar majority.

[rsynnott]

I don't think that it's fair to say that everyone, or even perhaps a majority, of leave voters voted that way due to xenophobia. They were lied to fairly blatantly about the economic aspects by a sophisticated campaign.