[nickpsecurity]

"That's trite xenophobic bullshit."

On the contrary, it just recognizes the fact that nations with competing interests exist. Many of which spy on us for similar reasons. You'd have to be xenophile to justify doing no spying when even our allies are doing the opposite.

"Treason laws and classified information have no place in anything claiming to be a developed democracy."

The existence of them in many democracies for good reason show otherwise. Plus, we've had methods for detecting and correcting abuses for years. Requires a certain percentage of honest politicians and active citizens, though. That problem was actually created and sustained by democracy a la tyranny of the majority. They're doing it again with likes of Hillary and Trump.

[Nullabillity]

> On the contrary, it just recognizes the fact that nations with competing interests exist. Many of which spy on us for similar reasons. You'd have to be xenophile to justify doing no spying when even our allies are doing the opposite.

Where does the line go for who is to be considered "other"? As someone living in Stockholm, why should I care more about companies in Gothenburg doing well than a company in Oslo? Or am I an outsider as well, since I have a mother from Copenhagen?

> The existence of them in many democracies for good reason show otherwise.

No, that just shows that they're not actual democracies either.

> Plus, we've had methods for detecting and correcting abuses for years. Requires a certain percentage of honest politicians and active citizens, though. That problem was actually created and sustained by democracy a la tyranny of the majority. They're doing it again with likes of Hillary and Trump.

Okay, this is getting far into Poe's law territory.

[nickpsecurity]

"Where does the line go for who is to be considered "other"? As someone living in Stockholm, why should I care more about companies in Gothenburg doing well than a company in Oslo? Or am I an outsider as well, since I have a mother from Copenhagen?"

Your wishes don't matter at all. You're not a competing nation referred to in my comment.

"No, that just shows that they're not actual democracies either"

Or that you don't know what a representational democracy is or think they all think like you. Look up KSI where you live to find something even less transparent than our NSA. (shocking really)

"Okay, this is getting far into Poe's law territory."

Nah, it's just a prerequisite for existence of a thing you're pretending to know about. Successful democracy and active citizenry go hand-in-hand. Without it, problems emerge.

[Nullabillity]

> Your wishes don't matter at all. You're not a competing nation referred to in my comment.

The point was that nations and citizenship are entirely arbitrary dividers.

> Or that you don't know what a representational democracy is or think they all think like you. Look up KSI where you live to find something even less transparent than our NSA. (shocking really)

If it doesn't live up to the definition of democracy (rule by the people), then it's by definition not a democracy.

NSA, FRA, KSI, whatever, this is about principles, not specific cases. It makes sense to say NSA on forums, since they're a name people recognise, and they're the ones capable of doing the most damage.

[nickpsecurity]

So, your purpose in arguing is strictly ideals and principles with no real-world context or constraints. And you don't know there are multiple forms of democracy?

Sophistry or trolling is undeniable now. Goodbye.