[Nadya]

I'm not seeing how his wearing a tie reinforces any negative stereotypes. If anything it just shows he's "an example of the stereotypical perception of a bow tie wearer" (a professor/teacher wearing a bow tie) which is... uh.. harmless? I see nothing else but some out-of-context quote form a short term Times writer.

Unless you're going to argue people should never do anything that is "stereotypical" of "that kind of person" I see no reason he shouldn't wear a bow tie.

[0] http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/26/fashion/sundaystyles/a-red...

[lisper]

So let me put this in perspective by saying that Bill Nye's bow tie is a minor detail compared to the bigger problem, which is that his pedantry is atrocious. And reasonable people can certainly disagree about fashion. So what follows is just my personal opinion of what is (or at least should be) ultimately an unimportant matter.

The relevant quotes from the wikipedia article are:

"the bow tie is ... an instant sign of nerddom ... not the mark of a ladies' man ... not sexy. Most men ... only wear bow ties with formal dress."

The last sentence is significant. Wearing a bow tie in an informal setting broadcasts an unawareness of (or an uncaring for) social norms (specifically, the social norm that bow ties are formal wear). Hence, it reinforces the negative stereotype of the scientist as someone whose social status is outside the mainstream, an "other", a position to be avoided rather than aspired to.

[Nadya]

>Wearing a bow tie in an informal setting broadcasts an unawareness of (or an uncaring for) social norms

Which to me is a good thing. The sooner "social norms" die out, the better. They're the source of many issues - and especially the source of the form of identity politics that exist today. The refusal to accept people who are "outside the social norm" and instead ostracize them for failing to "fit in" is the problem, in more ways than one, from my point of view.

>Hence, it reinforces the negative stereotype of the scientist as someone whose social status is outside the mainstream, an "other", a position to be avoided rather than aspired to.

Another way of saying this: It sends a positive message that you can be whatever you want to be, no matter how "weird" or "different" you are from society. That you can be yourself instead of what others wish to see you as. Even if you have a quirky or dated fashion sense.

I'll agree with you on the pedantry. I feel there is a time and place to be a pedant - and most of that is when it is mission critical or in academic work. It gets in the way of communication more times than it helps.

[lisper]

> The sooner "social norms" die out, the better.

You surely don't mean that. What you probably mean is something more like, "The sooner social norms that I don't like die out, the better." Humans are social animals, and hence social norms are an indispensable part of the human condition.

I totally agree that the world would be a better place if people didn't have to worry so much about what they wore. But you have to pick your battles, and I think there are bigger fish to fry.

[dragonwriter]

> Wearing a bow tie in an informal setting broadcasts an unawareness of (or an uncaring for) social norms (specifically, the social norm that bow ties are formal wear).

Its actually not that at all. While "most men ... only wear bow ties with formal dress" is true, that is not because bow ties in general are formal dress. The specific forms of bow ties which are formal dress are not what the small minority of men who wear bow ties in other contexts generally wear. They wear forms that are understood (or were, when they were in fashion) as informal dress, which are quite distinct. They just aren't currently popular fashion.

[lisper]

> The specific forms of bow ties which are formal dress are not what the small minority of men who wear bow ties in other contexts generally wear.

Well yeah, sure, but that doesn't help the situation at all. Clowns, for example, wear bow ties informally, but that's not exactly the kind of image I would like scientists to associate themselves with either. Yes, there was a time when bow ties were fashionable as non-formal wear among non-clowns, but as you yourself point out, those days are long gone.