[willchen]

As someone who's ordered from spoon rocket dozens of times over the past two years, I'm definitely sad to see it go.

A quick timeline (from what I can remember):

- Initially started out in Berkeley / Emeryville area by a couple of Berkeley alumni who had previously launched a food delivery startup focused on midnight munchies (aka, unhealthy food for college-type students). Each meal was initially only $6, tasted quite good, and delivery only took ~15 minutes.

- Expanded to Oakland area (first Downtown, then eventually other areas like Lake Merritt). Meals were still only $6, taste was usually good but sometimes wasn't as good. Delivery was still fairly fast (usually <15 minutes), but could take up to 30 minutes.

- Expanded to SF. Meals became more expensive and had variable pricing (I think it was first $8, $10, then $12, depending on which dish). A delivery fee ($2.50) was created. Food quality dropped (usually was OK, but not as good as it used to be); meals could take up to 1hr to get delivered (usually under <30 min though)

- Started their elite food delivery plans which provided free meal delivery and a bit of extra credit, by agreeing to pay upfront each month (e.g. $20).

Thoughts:

- From a business perspective, I think SpoonRocket (SR) made a lot of the right moves. While a lot of people say "disruptive innovation" loosely right now, I think SR actually did it by: 1) focusing on a low-end market that wasn't well addressed (e.g. college students), 2) used a technology to rapidly improve the experience for this low-end market (e.g. using Google Maps to efficiently route drivers to deliver on-demand meals), and 3) go upstream in the market to gain market share in higher-end consumer segments.

- So why did SR fail? I'm speculating here, but I think it's because scaling all these type of on-delivery startups is really, really hard work. Unlike Google or Facebook which could effortlessly scale up across the world with its technology-heavy solution, scaling up a company like SR requires hiring a linear amount of employees like drivers and support staff. As others have noted, it's difficult to get the economics right for an inherently low-margin business with a high labor component.

- Can other food startups succeed? I'm willing to bet most food startups probably won't survive this fundraising crunch if it extends another year. As far as I could tell, SR was ran as a very lean operation where they tried to batch deliveries, produce a small set of meals in large quantities, and focused on efficiency (e.g. calling you two minutes ahead of time to minimize delivery driver's waiting time). If SR couldn't make the economics work, I'm not sure how others could. Perhaps by going more high-end than SR, and charging a higher price (a la Munchery) or is it perhaps by selling a lot more quantity?

- Lastly, what I'm hoping for is the "Airbnb" of food, where regular people could cook meals and sell them to neighbors on a marketplace with reviews, pictures, etc. Of course the economics would be challenging like any food business, but that's the kind of service that I could see myself regularly using. There's also the regulatory side (after all Airbnb itself has followed the policy of 'asked for forgiveness, rather than permission') Who doesn't like the sound of buying a home cooked meal from a neighbor?

[Larrikin]

>Lastly, what I'm hoping for is the "Airbnb" of food, where regular people could cook meals and sell them to neighbors on a marketplace with reviews, pictures, etc.

I really don't want to buy food from random strangers that are not regularly being inspected for the cleanliness of their operations. A dirty room or a car is an inconvenience. A meal prepared in an unsanitary way could potentially kill you.

[doktrin]

> A dirty room or a car is an inconvenience.

I too have no desire to buy food from strangers, but I also feel like the potential risks of room-sharing or ride-sharing aren't limited to cleanliness. In both cases you're implicitly trusting a stranger with your physical safety.

Speaking for myself, I think I'm more comfortable with the notion of ride & room sharing because I can maintain a greater (and quite possibly illusory) sense of control. Drunk or unreliable driver? I can get out. Sketchy apartment? I can leave, or prop a chair against the door. etc.

[JoeAltmaier]

Seems to me, Neighbors would be less likely to have an inspected kitchen. I'd much rather get food from a kitchen 'vetted by SpoonRocket or some organization. In fact in my state, its illegal to sell food out of your kitchen. Unless it passes inspection, which no home kitchen could (e.g. need 7 sinks minimum and so on).

[doktrin]

> Who doesn't like the sound of buying a home cooked meal from a neighbor?

I won't claim this is a rational fear, but I'm personally far more apprehensive about buying food from my neighbor than I am about staying in said neighbor's home (airbnb) or getting a ride in their car (uber / lyft / etc.)

[joshrotenberg]

> - Lastly, what I'm hoping for is the "Airbnb" of food, where regular people could cook meals and sell them to neighbors on a marketplace with reviews, pictures, etc

This is already happening here: https://josephine.com/

[azinman2]

It's not legal to do so. You have to be a licensed commercial kitchen to do this stuff.

[ams6110]

Just like you need to be a licensed hotel operator to rent out rooms?

[azinman2]

I don't believe that there's anything like the FDA that mandates something equivalent to food safety for room rentals.

[pinot]

Usurping city hotelier taxes is one thing, hitting up the state BOH and FDA and asking for forgiveness after not being permitted is another.

[willchen]

That's cool! Have you ever tried them before?

I looked at them once before, and there's nothing super close to where I live (would need to drive to pick it up), but I'd definitely consider using it if there was someone who cooked within walking distance of me.

[joshrotenberg]

A friend of mine participates, so I tried some of his pretzels/granola and they were fantastic (and I'm not just saying that because he's a friend). I haven't tried anything else yet, but I've talked to him about the service and he's had a positive experience thus far.

[vidarh]

> Who doesn't like the sound of buying a home cooked meal from a neighbor?

It'd take a lot for me to consider it, because it creates all kinds of awkwardness if the quality is poor, and I'd have little reason to trust that they'd deliver consistent quality.

It'd need to be far cheaper than any alternative, and I'd need to not afford the alternatives, before I'd consider something like that.

[willchen]

I can definitely see the potential of awkwardness, especially if you know the neighbor already, etc. But like Airbnb, I think reviews go a long way to ensuring good quality in the long run.

[yishanl]

We tried a variant of this with Mise very early on but we've since pivoted to a much more stable model with massively improved results & proper regulation.

There are some highlights from what we learned trying "Airbnb for food."

1. Our target was not home chefs, but instead professional chefs. We worked in the industry for several months and identified how difficult being a chef. Lack of progression, opportunity, and a chance to showcase your skill.

2. We rented out a commercial kitchen for chefs, let them work their own hours, and cook the things that they wanted. We took on amateur chefs as an experiment, using their passion and food samples as determinant/predictor of success.

3. We wrote stories for every chef and dish. We'd even take photos of the chefs and edit those to make sure that they looked just as respectable as they sounded.

The Findings:

1. Food quality was inconsistent, ranging from inedible to passable. Because most professional chefs (professional doesn't mean much) and home cooks don't have any experience running a business of their own, their ability to scale and cost-control is poor.

2. That resulted in not only inconsistent food, but insanely overpriced meals ($15 for a bowl of chili, $16 for shrimp & pesto pasta).

3. The amateur chefs we worked with did not understand how to cook outside of recipes and/or they'd cut corners in production. Resulting in some shockingly bad food or overpriced mediocre meals.

4. Because there is no one checking over the food during production, you can't catch people cutting corners. If any of our chefs woke up on the wrong side of the bed that day, one of these things would happen (shitty food, tiny portions, unfulfilled orders).

5. No rational user is going to stick around and experiment their way around a Wild West marketplace that has such a wide range of quality and price. And no amount of "humanization" with stories, photos is going to save the fact that the food sucks.

6. Chefs are really good at pumping up their own food. "Best in the Bay Area", "everyone tells me they love it", "people ask me to open my own restaurant all the time", "there's so much love in this", or "I cooked for X person for Y years". (None of this means anything.)

7. Poor retention (and deservedly so from shitty product) and declining sales. With small orders, our chefs earned minimum wage or worse, which either drove them away ("I quit, fuck you!") or encouraged them to cut even more corners (smaller portions, terrible inedible quality).

8. We experienced ridiculous turnover (someone would quit every week, mad rush to find someone else to replace, unconsciously lowering standards in desperation).

9. At the end of the day, if the food sucks, it sucks. Doesn't matter if it's coming from your "neighbors" or "supporting the local chef down the street".

We've now partner with the best Bay Area mobile food businesses and sell their most popular items. Mise is now sustainable, food quality is consistent/high, customers are really happy (feels awesome whenever we have power users). And we've been able to offer more affordable and better-tasting meals week over week.

Ben (my awesome cofounder) and I take a lot of pride in what we do now, because we know it's awesome food going out to awesome people at affordable prices.

Order for the week ahead, get it all delivered to your door on Saturday, and enjoy a meal on your own schedule. :)

www.eatmise.com

[creamyhorror]

Thanks for the enlightening view from the inside. Maybe you should submit it to HN as a blogpost and get more attention for Mise.

[yishanl]

Thanks! Means a lot. It's a good idea - one day, I hope when we're successful, perhaps then writing such findings then may be more meaningful and valuable as learnings for others.

[bmelton]

> Lastly, what I'm hoping for is the "Airbnb" of food, where regular people could cook meals and sell them

Given the current lay of the land, I sadly find that to be a less likely to survive the regulatory requirements.

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2013/09/11/cbs-2-investigation-u...