[dpeterson]

Hmm, that's why I have spent every second outside work and my family working my ass off on a startup on the minute chance I create something of enough value that will free me from my m-f 40+. Huge motivator for me. Take that motivator away and I doubt you see nearly the # of people working hard to create value. I believe that's why socialism fails.. Every... Single... Time. But hey, we can do it better right?

[dota_fanatic]

Don't you find it alarming that the only motivation you have to work is so that you can afford to not have to work m-f 40+? What are you going to do if you fail to 'create value' (read: create something that is successfully monetized) and you're looking back on years of your life that you didn't spend more w/ yourself, family, and friends in your little free time, instead giving yourself for the success of a startup? How will you feel, seeing others do little and earn hordes of cash due to being on the right side of automation or being in the 'right' networks?

Wouldn't you prefer to be free to work for things that you think are valuable... not in your free time, y'know, the time that should be for yourself and the things you love?

What's up with all these weird open source folk, working hard to create value and giving it away for free, uplifting for all? I hear this linux thing is pretty cool. It's almost like we can capture productivity in code and then copy it endlessly for practically free and everyone benefits. How are these people motivated?!

Maybe we should pursue this cooperation thing... who am I kidding. It fails every. single. time.! Right?

[quietplatypus]

Pretty much this, and I argue that it is because of motivations like his that we end up with companies purely meant to flout regulations to make money for themselves, like Zenefits, than anything that is of real value.

[sdfin]

What is 'value'? Escaping the rat race can be a great motivator, but I think there are many other valuable motivating facts of life that can successfully motivate people. E.g.: curing sicknesses, understanding nature and the universe, overcome obstacles to human well being... Why do you think that people like Bill Gates keep working, without the need of doing m-f 40+ ?

You seem to be justifing the concentration of capital and power in a few hands in order to 'motivate' the rest of the population.

[quietplatypus]

So you only work on things purely under threats and external pressure? Let's hope no one ever has to work with you.

Granted, no one really does anything without considering the possibility of that thing causing them to go six feet under, but you've stated that the only motivation to do anything ever, to decrease the local entropy around yourself even one bit, is under the threat of death.

Are you not aware how unhealthy, conformist, tool-like of a life-philosophy this is?

(Also, you don't need to exactly buy into all this startup cult shit and work your ass off from the beginning, just do anything that makes you more money than you put in. I know this is obvious but judging from most people like you, you need that dose of reality)

[vacri]

> I believe that's why socialism fails.. Every... Single... Time.

Sweden is doing fine. Australia is doing fine. Those two countries are generally in the top 5 of any quality-of-life measure you care to name. The UK is mostly doing fine.

Socialism is not communism.

[unclebucknasty]

The US is doing fine too. Mostly.