[wendroid]

The third-world isn't some laggard full of overbreeding simpletons. It was created in the 18th & 19th century by well armed invaders helped at the end of the 19th C by drought & flood that killed 50m people in India & China and 50m in S. America.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Late_Victorian_Holocausts

Indian & Chinese civilisation was crushed by armies & opium.

[_h4xr]

The third-world isn't some laggard full of overbreeding simpletons.

Any concrete reason for that belief? It looks like the "overbreeding" is objectively true: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_birth_rate . As far as simpletons go, you tell me: is there any intelligence test you know of that routinely ranks people in Djibouti over people in Japan? If not, it sounds like your statement is unfounded.

The rest of your interpretation is also suspect. The places Victorians conquered weren't more advanced than the places the Victorians came from. Regardless of the reason, Europe was more technologically advanced than the rest of the world, and they used that advantage to conquer as much of the world as they could.

When you complain about how the Victorians ran things, you have to compare it to something. If you compare, e.g., the Congo in 1955 (http://www.time.com/time/printout/0,8816,866343,00.html ) to the Congo in 2008 (http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1713275,00.htm... ) you get the idea. You might not like how imperialists run things--but they run things well because they run them for profit. You can also consider Singapore (which is basically Victorian, and basically paradise on earth for law-abiding people).

[pyre]

> You can also consider Singapore (which is basically Victorian, and basically paradise on earth for law-abiding people).

It's interesting that you need to preface that with 'law-abiding people.' What happens when you are accidentally on the other side of the law?

Update: Maybe I should be more specific in what I mean. In Thailand you aren't a 'law-abiding citizen' if you criticize the king. What similar laws does Singapore have? What happens is someone doesn't like me and decides to set me up for a crime I am no guilty of (e.g. deface some property and then claim that I did it)? The only problem that I have with harsh justice systems: What happens if you're an innocent person, but that system believes you to be guilty?

[_h4xr]

You know, their crime rate is amazingly low. Seriously, if you compare their numbers to the US, your first instinct is to assume that they moved the decimal point over. So it seems that these "accidents" are rare, there.

[wendroid]

Disneyland with the Death Penalty

We sent William Gibson to Singapore to see whether that clean dystopia represents our techno future.

http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/1.04/gibson.html

[pradocchia]

When you complain about how the Victorians ran things, you have to compare it to something.

How about pre-Victorian rule? European profit seeking turned Congo in to a hell hole.

[_h4xr]

I don't understand. That Time article is very clear about how beneficial European rule was. It goes on and on--about the mines and the industries and the shops and the general sense of law and order.

Did the Belgians just find a country like that, and take it over?

[pradocchia]

You honestly don't know the history of Congo? Here's a starting point: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congo_Free_State

The baskets of severed hands, set down at the feet of the European post commanders, became the symbol of the Congo Free State. ... The collection of hands became an end in itself. Force Publique soldiers brought them to the stations in place of rubber; they even went out to harvest them instead of rubber... They became a sort of currency. They came to be used to make up for shortfalls in rubber quotas, to replace... the people who were demanded for the forced labour gangs; and the Force Publique soldiers were paid their bonuses on the basis of how many hands they collected.