[r0naa]

I do have a Facebook account, primarily because I am studying abroad and I need to keep in touch with my family and close friends and Facebook is, thus far, the best way to share what is going on in my life. It kind of allow me to "broadcast" my life events.

Now, I really dislike what I just read.

I wonder if tech companies have a moral obligation to disclose to the user what are the terms of the contracts.

While ToS and Privacy Policy are public documents, I don't think they are close to anything readable for the layman. They are mostly pile of legal garbage and it is virtually impossible to go through them everytime you sign-up for a service.

That is why I would like to put the emphasis on clarity here. What if?

What if technology companies were forced to disclose clearly what signing-up for their product entails with respect to user privacy. I am thinking of something alongside this:

""" Hello r0naa,

Welcome on Facebook, we hope that you will have a great experience here.

Facebook will allow you to: - easily communicate with your friends

- share photos, videos and play games with your friends

- keep in touch with distant relatives

On the other hand, we will:

- keep a record of the messages you send to your friends

- keep a permanent record of the photos you have shared on Facebook

- keep a log of all the websites you have visited that contain a "like" button.

Moreover, you should be aware that we will disclose all your personal data to the US government if we are issued a NS letter.

Hope you have a great day,

"""

To be clear, I am not saying that this is the right solution. Only, I believe it is pretty obvious that there is a problem and that a lot of people who are not technically literate are not able to make a informed choice about whether or not they want to give up their privacy, even partially.

I hope it will spawn an interesting discussion, feel free to share your ideas and suggestions.

[toddchambery]

Nothing in that disclosure would dissuade (or even give pause to) any of the people I know who use Facebook.

"keep a permanent record of the messages you send to your friends" "keep a permanent record of the photos you have shared on Facebook"

That's great! A free backup.

"keep a log of all the websites you have visited that contain a "like" button."

That's great! So I'll get feeds that better reflect my interests.

I haven't used Facebook since the EFF experimental app that showed all the actual, real information (real names in the graph) FB leaked to any game you clicked 'OK' to. But noone else cares, FB is still growing, and that's OK.

I'm OK with the way Google handles my personal information (doing the match making with advertisers and keeping my details private), and enjoy the benefits this enables.

[joosters]

It's not just that privacy policies / ToS are using complex legal language. The real problem is that they are so broad.

For example, just about every privacy policy states that information collected can be used to improve the company's products & services, or to help develop new ones. That effectively gives the company free reign to do whatever they like with your data. Who knows that products they may decide to offer?

A company could release a new product tomorrow that sells your individual browsing data to the highest bidder, and that would be covered by this clause. Also remember that almost all policies state that they can be updated without notice too. Do No Evil today, Evil tomorrow...

[username223]

> The real problem is that they are so broad.

Before I click the "go away" button, I interpret the wall of text as "we'll do whatever we want, and if you disagree, you can try to sue us, but the PR campaign will be what matters, not the legal stuff."

[qmalxp]

I thought the fact that messages and photos are kept was a feature. As in, I can scroll back a decade in my photo albums and look at pictures from my high school graduation.

[ljk]

It's unfortunate we have to be tracked so much to use the services, but I guess if it's not free then we're the product; This site does a pretty good job of providing the tl;dr of TOS https://tosdr.org/

Sometimes I feel like ignorance is bliss though, especially with how much information these popular services actually collect from us

[narrowrail]

The only rule is: What a company can do and what they can't do. If it's possible, assume it's being done and protect yourself accordingly (i.e proxies, blockers, host files, etc.)

[nine_k]

I dunno. I automatically assume that everything that passes any third-party site unencrypted can be intercepted, retained and subsequently disclosed to advertisers, government, or whatever else. This especially applies to for-profit companies for which I'm not a paying client but the commodity being sold. I mean, I don't need to read TOS to assume this, it's just common sense to me.

Probably I've been on the internet for too long.

[r0naa]

Oh that's the case for pretty much anyone on HN I am sure. I was explicitly referring to the rest of the population that is largely illiterate when it comes to technology (they just consume).

There are similar warnings on products like food, drugs etc...