[makomk]

Do persecuted non-nerds have the right to (in any way) cordon off computer science as a refuge free from nerdiness? Because that's what articles like these seem to be suggesting we'd need to do, by saying that nerd social cues like Star Wars and geeky T-shirts are excluding women.

[tptacek]

I think that's an overwrought reading of the article, for two reasons: first, the article isn't prescriptive about Star Wars, and second, it's reporting simple facts; whether you feel comfortable about it or not, nerd culture's coupling with software development does alienate potential entrants to the field.

But let's not bother deploying dueling readings from the article, and instead see how much you and I actually disagree:

I do not in fact think it's reasonable to suggest that individual software developers should avoid nerd signifiers to avoid alienating people. I feel safe presuming we agree about that.

Do you feel like it's reasonable for companies to avoid aggressive identification with nerd culture? To not ask candidates what their favorite Star Wars movie is, or to try to balance out outings and fringe benefits so they only appeal to sci-fi fandom?

[blackguardx]

Do companies do that? I've never experienced any embrace of "nerd culture" at any place I've worked.

[tptacek]

Sure! Here's an example I'll ruefully draw from the last company I helped manage: all-hands offsites at local breweries.

[blackguardx]

I'm a hardware engineer. Most hardware companies are too tight fisted to have offsites (making physical things is expensive). The few that I've been on have been very tame because the last thing management wants is an offended employee.

Having an offsite at a brewery is kinda shitty because not everyone likes to drink. Did anyone try to suggest another venue?

[tptacek]

Yes, or at least, the concern was raised (among the small minority of people who weren't excited about going to Three Floyds).

It's not, like, a management decision I'm super duper proud of.

[rewqfdsa]

I don't understand the connection between beer and nerd culture --- or masculine culture, actually, since plenty of women I know love beer.

[tptacek]

I wasn't trying to be gender-specific with my example, just showing how something you can do as a manager to build culture can exclude and alienate people.

(Though: I do think beer drinking trends masculine.)

[ams6110]

It's really hard to win at this. Whatever you do as a culture or team building exercise is going to either offend or just be uncomfortable to some subset of employees, unless it's so bland as to be boring for everyone.

[rewqfdsa]

Right: nobody bonds over building shareholder value. They bond over shared interests. But there are no _universal_ interests, so team-building is a quandary. I think the best you can do is rotate events and make sure most people are interested most of the time.

Maybe after the beer offsite, you can visit a winery, or a famous local coffee house, and then a museum.

[lightcatcher]

Beer seems more in-line with bro culture than nerd culture. This particular article seems more against corporate nerd culture than against corporate bro culture, but I've definitely seem articles speaking out against brogramming culture. Bros and nerds are quite different things (even though it seems like there are a lot of hybrids in Silicon Valley), but it seems to me that the only way to not alienate anyone is to have zero corporate culture.

[lightcatcher]

Palantir is named after an item in Lord of the Rings. From what I've heard from friends working there, they have an internal conference called HobbitCon, meetings rooms named after LotR, and refer to their office as "the shire".