[cm2187]

I like the idea that CIA officers are directly identifiable by their absence from the database. It reminds me of submarines and sonars. I understand that modern submarines are pretty good at diverting sonar waves so that they have a small footprint. However when a fishing boat passes over a submarine while scanning the ocean floor looking for fish, the submarine becomes immediately visible as a dark shape of sonar waves not returning from the ocean floor.

[Luc]

That smells fishy, as it would be something exploited immediately by any anti-submarine vessel.

[EliRivers]

Anti-submarine vessels have to do one thing really well to have any chances; be quiet. Fishing vessels can happily plough the ocean wave pinging to their heart's content. An anti-submarine vessel that did that quickly becomes a target, or if the submarine is feeling generous, something to go around - thanks for telling us where you are.

There's a time and a place for active sonar in finding and killing submarines, but it's not from your anti-submarine ship, all day every day.

[Luc]

Sure, but I just don't think a sub would show up as a black, signal-free shape on a fishing boat's sonar, except under contrived conditions.

Though I may be judging it wrong based on only having used crappy sonar equipment.

[3pt14159]

Then part of your navy is hacked fishing boat sonar kits and an uplink to the anti-submarine vessel. :)

[CapitalistCartr]

The Soviets used to do that with their "fishing fleet". We would send submarines out the Strait of Juan De Fuca, it would drop down to 1,000 feet, and the "fishing boats" would lose it every time. It still didn't work. I don't know of any reliable way to find a submarine, even today.

[TeMPOraL]

Which, if the word of it ever got out, would paint fishing boats as a valid target in combat operations.

[EliRivers]

On an interesting related note, during the recent Russian occupation of parts of Ukraine, a helpful app was created and released by "Russia" [1] that would allow pro-Russian civilians in the region to act as reconnaissance for the Russian and pro-Russian forces. Very simple; if you see some Ukrainian military, push the matching picture on the app. Your location and chosen picture are uploaded, and whoever is sitting at the other end sees all the results.

Bingo; you've turned the civil population into military reconnaissance. Are they now a valid target? They certainly don't seem to be just plain civilians anymore, but they're not lawful combatants either.

As it turned out, I am led to believe that the app wasn't a great success, but it's still a disturbing trend.

[1] I say "Russia" because I can't dig out more detail right now. Obviously company X working with agency Y or some other such.

[cm2187]

Plus you have to be right above the submarine. The ocean is vast.