[ChuckMcM]

True, my thinking was one level up the stack, Phoenix is (according to Chris' talk) a framework for building applications. And it does this using Elixir running on Erlang. Is Elixir special?

Sure it is, but "framework for building apps using language X which is run by virtual machine Y" is the basic pattern for JavaScript, Clojure, Scala, Java, and others. There are a lot of them, they have varying levels of integration.

Can I build a discussion forum in Phoenix? Sure, it has all the tools. Can I build it using PHP or Ruby? Sure those have tools too. Can I create an integrated IDE with my langauge and my execution environment? Sure we can do that too like Light Table.

So is it just Visual Basic all over again? Thinking of it that way is probably not conducive to polite conversation :-) but in many ways it is. We have a scripted language (Elixir), a virtual machine (Erlang), a "window" system (HTML5), and a set of APIs we can call on.

That is great, doesn't solve a new problem but solves an existing problem in a new way. And I watched Chris' talk and read the documentation, and I still don't feel like I have a good feel for why its better than what came before.

[davelnewton]

Describe a "new problem". I only rarely encounter truly unique problems.

One thing it does do is allow scalability in a pretty straight-forward, integrated way.

[ChuckMcM]

I like the scaling aspect of it very much.

There are lots of "new" problems with respect to changing conditions in our day to day lives. Here are a few

- Identity management across Internet and non-Internet properties

- Configuration, control, auditing, and monitoring of billions of Beacon level devices

- Zero knowledge proofs as a technique for anonymous and no repudiated purchases online

- "home" level cloud services for local and on the road implementation of always available services (mail, journaling, calendaring, Etc.)

- Reliable third party payment systems (somewhat of an old system but one that benefits from revisiting with current technology from time to time)

- Navigation and cartography tools for people in disconnected regions of the planet.

- Civil process augmentation with automation and authentication.

- Connectivity as a tax payer civic utility, without an editorial bias.

-Dynamic skills assessment for students in the presence of confounding factors (mostly remote access)

- Low friction capital markets for charitable giving (think Watsi but for everything, and with better controls than 'GoFundMe')

- Providing civic services for indigenous homeless populations.

I could go on, there are lots and lots of problems. But to be clear it isn't a criticism of Phoenix that they are not solving a new problem, the feedback was that there are lots of solutions to the general form of problem they are solving and, as feedback on this announcement, I was trying to learn from their materials how they were different (and presumptively better) than those other solutions. I'm still looking for that summary somewhere.

[prapam2]

These seems like architecture level problems rather then framework level.